“None of us want more of the same. None of us”
No one outside the walls of Sega can know for sure what’s to come in the episodic Sonic the Hedgehog 4. But one fan has issued a pre-emptive strike of sorts, compelling others not to purchase any more episodes through a petition unless core concerns from Episode I are tackled.
“You failed to make the sequel Sonic fans have wanted,” says the petition’s creator Orlando Lewis in his open letter. “You disappointed your retro crowd and you disappointed the younger crowd as well.”
As has been a constant ever since the leaks a year ago, physics are a key part of the argument:
If there’s any one specific problem that’s the number one concern in Sonic 4, it is definitely the physics. In the classic Sonic games, the physics engine was all about the sense of momentum. Running down slopes would help Sonic to accelerate, and running up a slope would cause Sonic to slow down a little. The steeper the slope, the more pronounced the effect, and rolling in to Sonic’s trademark “spinball” form would only increase his slope sensitivity. A well-timed spin would allow Sonic to blow through levels at far faster speeds than he could ever achieve by running on foot. It was a marvelous physics engine emphasized flow and momentum. It was the physics engine that made Sonic the Hedgehog more unique than any other generic platformer during the 90s.
Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode 1 does NONE of these things. For one thing, Sonic is incredibly stiff and his acceleration is rather sluggish. But then again, all you need is a minuscule amount of speed to go up tall 90 degree walls while Sonic’s still in his walking animation. Rolling in Sonic’s spinball form is next to useless outside of scripted scenes where one of every hundredth speed booster force you in the spinball form. Plus, Sonic loses all horizontal momentum if you let go of the D-Pad/Analog stick. There are times where if the player wants to spindash off of a ledge, he will shoot off but stop and fall straight down unless he’s constantly holding forward (whereas the classic games’ physics engine lets your momentum continue regardless of directional input). Simply doing any type of platforming challenge feels incredibly awkward and clunky beyond belief.
The petition asks the undersigned to “refuse to purchase any future episodes of Sonic the Hedgehog 4″ until improvements are made. You can interpret the 4 total signatures to that cause any way you’d like.














^ and I’m not going to take part of it.
Also, don’t think my standards are any lower than yours just because I happen to have gotten used to Sonic looking the way he has and Eggman having the name he has had for the last 13 years. I happened to love Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2 and that’s where those changes were instituted. But because I think differently regarding those games and the changes they introduced my standards must be lower than yours? Dude, that’s just arrogant and rude.
Wow. 203 comments and 59 signatures before the week was over.
I would just remark here and respond to some of these comments, but even this article has gone on long enough.
Anyways, welcome to the TSSZ community, Anon.
This is absolutely appalling. I can’t believe you people would have the good, classic Dimps Sonic buried to make more room for more Sonic Team kiddie Colors/Unleashed/Black Knight crap. Sonic 4 was the best Sonic game to hit consoles since Sonic Adventure 2. Geez, what on earth has happened to this fan base? It’s no wonder there’s practically no good Sonic sites left on the net. All the fans of the true Sonic ditched the series when Heroes came around and it started to go on a downward spiral.
Sonic 4 was NOT a broken game. It had some very, VERY minor physics and design flaws, such as Sonic coming out of spinball formation off a ramp and Sonic being able to sometimes stand on the side of a ramp, but nothing that made the game unplayable what so ever. This is the type of moaning that needs to stop. You modern Sonic fanboys are absolutely going to ruin this once great series into the ground by turning it into Sesame Sonic. You should all be ashamed of yourselves, but I know you won’t as usual. In fact, I know you stubborn little whinebags are going to try flaming the crap out of me for dissing your precious Sesame Sonic games, so as usual, I’m not even gonna bother reading any more of these comments. *Poof!*
how is colors music bad? tropical resort,the final boss theme and aquatic park were some of my favorite themes in that game. plus on another note most of the stuff you’ve been saying like sonic is ugly and sonic colors is a bad game is a OPINION. while i agree on some pieces like the colors storyline(but is was made for kids)and acting(except for pollock.)other pieces i straight up disagree on like music and sonics look. we can all have different views and i respect your opinion but you can’t claim your opinion as fact. from what i can see a lot of the “old-school” fans here are perfectly fine with the way sonic looks. if it doesn’t matter to most people then what’s the big deal?
by the way this is @Anon.
@Anon:
“I don’t think of Sonic 4 as a “classic-style” game, even though that’s what Sega was trying to go for”
“Not to mention they failed miserably at doing so.”
I still consider 4 to be an okay game, but as far as being “Classic”, I think “failed” is already assumed at this point.
“If this game was called “Sonic Dash: Part I” or some crap like that, then the retro-fans wouldn’t be causing such a shit-storm”
“We’d still complain about the hideous characters,”
“Hideous characters”? …How is Sonic is “stretched out”? If you mean “growth”, then yeah, he grew… oh… 1.5 inches “taller”. Wow. Besides, wasn’t Sonic always 3 feet tall? Or is it just the art style that makes him appear taller?
“terrible gameplay, crap music,”
Okay, good point.
and stupid and or inapproriate storylines, too.”
…There’s a story? XD
As for your complaints about “Robotnik v. Eggman”, yes, Eggman is a stupid name, but when you think about it, so is Robotnik. Besides, Eggman is “Robotnik’s” actual name (in Japan anyway, but apparently no one gives two shits even though Japanese people made this damn series XD).
@Ceejus: Sonic Colors was awesome. You’re just a side-scrolling purist.
@ Matt
“I happen to know that bitching about things that do not matter to most people”
And what do you mean by “things that don’t matter”? Story, visuals, and character design? Cause those DO matter. See, a video game is a work of art, and every part of it should be beautiful.
“FACT: Sonic 4 is a poorly-designed Sonic game.”
Indeed.
“OPINION: Eggman is a bad name for Sonic’s rival”
Fact to support that opinion: It’s a stupid name that makes you not wanna take that villain seriously. What if Kim Jong Il suddednly wanted us to call him Squatty FlatHead. Would you take him seriously?
Oh, and whether his that was his name in Japan or not doesn’t matter. Robotnik is more fitting, because he turns animals into robots, called Badniks.
“you can’t change people’s minds about Sonic’s appearance and Eggman’s name!”
Now, how many times have I said no one ever had to agree with me again? Like, almost every other post.
“Like I said, for the most part I AGREE with you on those points”
Which I appreciate.
“Rail against these facets of the Sonic franchise all you want, but the arguments are just going to go around and around in circles because there is no decisive evidence to prove that one way is better than another.”
Yeah there is actually. The opinions backed up with facts are the best.
” You’d need to institute some massive-scale poll in order to definitively prove whats better for the Sonic series because what’s better for the Sonic series can only be decided by the majority of Sonic fans.”
Exactly. So whenever a new Sonic game that sucks comes out, more people should complain. Would you like me to post what Sonic is all about for the 4th time?
” I happened to love Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2 and that’s where those changes were instituted. But because I think differently regarding those games and the changes they introduced my standards must be lower than yours?”
Read my posts, please. As I just said earlier in this comment and am now repeating myself, no one ever had to agree with me. So please, don’t pull the victim card. Thank you.
@ sonicdudefan1996
“most of the stuff you’ve been saying like sonic is ugly and sonic colors is a bad game is a OPINION”
Those who say that can’t support their opinions with facts that are relevant to the subject to back up their side with.
“you can’t claim your opinion as fact”
I don’t.
@ Ceejus
“Sonic 4 was NOT a broken game. It had some very, VERY minor physics and design flaws”
You call these “minor” ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nDRsjiXiMo
How many times have I posted this video, now?
“Sonic 4 was the best Sonic game to hit consoles since Sonic Adventure 2.”
No.
@ Amuro
“Hideous characters”? …How is Sonic is “stretched out”? If you mean “growth”, then yeah, he grew… oh… 1.5 inches “taller”. Wow. Besides, wasn’t Sonic always 3 feet tall? Or is it just the art style that makes him appear taller?”
Because as I’ve also explained a million times already, his legs and limbs and small., jellybean-shaped body give him a stretchy looking appearence, as if he was somehow fused with Gumbi. It’s not even the height that matters, it’s his humanoid proportions that give him this look. His classic and modern designs are like night and day.
“…There’s a story? XD”
Yes there is, actually.
@anon: Wait, you say Sonic’s all stretched out like Gumbi?!!… You… You’re the GAME DUDE!!! Alex, is that you?!!
I miss Vulpine.
Why does any of this still matter?!
My god, you “true” Sonic fans complain more than people do with DLC. I grew up with the Genesis Sonic, and yes while his art changed, the game play for the most part has always stayed the same…Well not the Night Stages for Unleashed or those stupid story book Sonic games. Sonic 4 was a good game and I’m looking forward to Episode 2 with the return of Metal (Spoiler? Don’t know if everyone got the Emeralds.)
Though if there was ever any reason what so ever for me to never play a Sonic game again would have to be you whiners. Come on, if you grew up with the Genesis too, you must be 17 + and yet you have nothing better to do with your time other than whine about the PHYSICS of a video game character? Grow the hell up.
@ hsvelocity
“Wait, you say Sonic’s all stretched out like Gumbi?!!… You… You’re the GAME DUDE!!! Alex, is that you?!!”
I have no idea whta you’re talking about and never even haerd about that before that comment.
“the game play for the most part has always stayed the same”
*facepalm* No, it hasn’t.
“Though if there was ever any reason what so ever for me to never play a Sonic game again would have to be you whiners”
More like, you’ve got nothing on us because we actually have valid criticizm.
“whine about the PHYSICS of a video game character?”
Here’s some hard evidence that the physics suck.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nDRsjiXiMo
And no it’s not whining.
In terms of gameplay, Sonic 4 shuld have looked like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxXycBv3Rlk
“Grow the hell up.”
Good idea. Don’t comment again until you’ve done so, please.
*facepalm* No, it hasn’t. onward
This was @ Wolf
@Anon: Even if Eggman was still being called Robotnik, are you seriously telling me that we’re supposed to take this bumbling fat-ass seriously as a villain? I’m sorry, but “NOPE.AVI”. And I know you really don’t care (not calling you out, mind you, just sayin), but I like how Sonic looks nowadays. Sonic’s old design looked too much like Mickey Mouse (the chubby round body, stick figure arms and legs, big feet and whatnot)
i love how people are overreacting to this. And i know some retro fan is gonna be like, “oh this game wasn’t 100% like the classics, IT MUST SUCK!” I know some “true sonic fan” is going to respond to me in 5 paragraphs saying basically what i just narrowed down.
.
.
.
really? Don’t forget what we’re talking about. A game. That’s it. It’s not some kind of heretic action against god if they don’t do something 100% like the classics. Don’t like it? Don’t buy it. I mean this is pathetic. I almost feel sorry for you people, but then i remember how dicky you guys are. Newsflash. Not everyone thinks the same way you do. People enjoyed sonic 4, why are you forcing your own opinions on other people? Calling them idiots and “not real sonic fans” is fucking child’s play. Grow a backbone.
@ Amuro
“are you seriously telling me that we’re supposed to take this bumbling fat-ass seriously as a villain”
I’m not saying you should take him seriously, it qwas just such an awesome concept. He captured animals and turned them into robots, and his name, Robotnik, was more fitting because of that.
“I like how Sonic looks nowadays”
Which is perfectly fine.
“Sonic’s old design looked too much like Mickey Mouse (the chubby round body, stick figure arms and legs, big feet and whatnot)”
But that’s exactly it. Sonic is that type of character. Like a Mickey, only cooler. What’s wrong with that? It doesn’t make him childish or anything.
@ darkgomugomu
“And i know some retro fan is gonna be like, “oh this game wasn’t 100% like the classics, IT MUST SUCK!”
And I know since no one ever said that, you just made shit up in your head instead of replying to anything anyone said, you must be stupid.
Oh and if you’re just going with that because a bunch of other butthurt Sonicfags said that, that shows you can’t think for yourself.
I would have happily been respectful towards you if you didn’t type up such a stupid comment.
“Don’t forget what we’re talking about. A game.”
And a rather bad one at that.
“Newsflash. Not everyone thinks the same way you do. People enjoyed sonic 4, why are you forcing your own opinions on other people?”
Newsflash: I’ve been saying like every other post that no one has to agree with me. Don’t believe me? I DARE you to go back to my first post (I’ve been posting since the bottom of Page 1 of these comments), and challenge you to COUNT how many times I said so, too. So no, I’m not shoving my opinions down anyone’s throat, and you and everyone else that says that is pulling the victim card. Why don’t YOU grow a backbone?
Oh and as for the Sonic 4 part, I was just telling Amuro a few posts ago, that it’s perfectly fine if he likes it.
In fact, I like Amuro, despite the fact he has different views than me, because unlike you, he doesn’t type up retarded comments.
@Anon:
“I’m not saying you should take him seriously, it qwas just such an awesome concept. He captured animals and turned them into robots, and his name, Robotnik, was more fitting because of that.”
Okay, now I see your point.
“But that’s exactly it. Sonic is that type of character. Like a Mickey, only cooler. What’s wrong with that? It doesn’t make him childish or anything.”
True that.
Oh, and thanks for the compliment in your post to darkgomugomu. When it comes to debates about the newer games like Unleashed, Colors, and case-in-point, Sonic 4, I try to look at both sides of the argument before giving my views on it so I don’t look like a fantard XD
@Anon
Umm, I think you’re misunderstanding Darkgomugomu a bit. See, he was saying that someone was most likely going to SAY what he said. NOT that they DID. I also don’t think he was saying that only to you, it was for EVERYONE in general.
I only say this because your comment sounded like nothing but random attacks, and things he wasn’t saying/directing at you.
@ Amuro
“Okay, now I see your point”
Thank you. And aside from calling him Robotnik because he turns animals into robots, which represents is villainy and makes him more intimidatting, I don’t see the point in the name “Eggman”. Because of his bulbous body? They may as well have named him “Fat Boy” or something ridiculous like that. Robotnik symbolizes how he’s a villain, Eggman just sounds clownish and doesn’t really have meaning behind it, other than he’s fat, which isn’t interesting.
That’s how I see it anyway. Do you HAVE to agree? Absolutely not!
“Oh, and thanks for the compliment in your post to darkgomugomu”
No prob.
” I try to look at both sides of the argument before giving my views on it so I don’t look like a fantard XD”
And that’s very good. But you know something, Amuro? As I’ve beem saying, I don’t care if people like the new games, and the ONLY time I dub someone as a “fantard” is, whenever I share my views, those people get all like “You’re just saying that because you don’t like it!!”, “That’s just your opinion!”, “You just can’t accept change!!” and other disrespectful comments like that, as you can imagine, it gets annoying.
So, despite the fact you like the new Sonic and games, I don’t think you’re a fantard at all, because you’ve been respectful about it the whole time, and that is very much appreciated.
@ Monic
“See, he was saying that someone was most likely going to SAY what he said. NOT that they DID”
It’s incredibly stupid either way. No one is complaining because Sonic 4 it’s “not classic” or “100% like the classics”. It’s because the game sucks, and most people, classic fan or modern fan, agree with that.
And nevermind the fact that I myself not only explained why the game sucks, but also said to other people that it’s perfectly fine if they like the game.
It doesn’t matter who he says it to, it’s a stupid thing to say anyway. Just like saying 1 + 1 = 11.
“your comment sounded like nothing but random attacks”
That comment sounds like you just assumed that and didn’t even read what was said. And even if I sound a little harsh at times, it’s ok to be arrogant when you’re right.
Well, guys! They showed Classic Sonic in the 20th Anniversary trailor. Me, Nicochi, and mnay others are Very happy about this… Which is to say, if he’s actually gonna be playable in the game. Even if the gameplay sucks, this is such a huge step forward, it’s unreal…And no, NO ONE CARES that Classic Sonic has buckles on his shoes, all we ever wanted was a Sonic that looks like Sonic, and that’s what we got. Good job, SEGA!
Now, all that needs to happen is that they get the gameplay right, and we WILL have the new Sonic game eveyone’s been wanting for all these years, and I will now once again post what that gameplay should be like:
Sonic is NOT about speed.
It’s about having huge open worlds to explore, that contain platforming sequences and organic shaped turrain with slopes and hills so that you can gather momentum.
See, in Sonic 1-2-3K, you controll Sonic like a ball by manipulating momentum gained by running or rolling down hills. Also, Sonic is actually a slow and heavy character, and his realistic way he accellorates (starting slow, and slowly gaining speed) is what makes his top speed so satisfying.
Did you, if you play any of the 4 classics (3 if you count SOnic 3 and Knuckles as one game),then go play Super Mario World, Sonic doesn’t run ANY faster than Mario, when you hold the B button to run?
Mixing Momementum and Platforming is what created this unique gameplay style in the first place. But aside from that, Sonic also needs huge open worlds to explore, with many different paths. One goal at the end, but you can get there any way you want.
What we really want, is a new AND good Sonic game, 2D or 3D doesn’t matter but a well-made 3D Sonic game would be awesome!
A 3D Sonic game would have huge, open worlds, Like Super Mario 64, Donkey Kong 64, or even Banjo-Kazooie/Tooie, but with lots of hills and slopes to gather momentum, many platforming-based (usually reaquireing you to jump a lot) obstacles, and tons of hidden stuff, like the giant rings from Sonic 3K that allow you a chance to get the chaos emeralds.
Finally, the story. It’s actually symbolic for “Nature Vs. Technology”. Sonic and his animal friends destroy Robotnik and his robots, and he also symbolizes us, humans. The general symbolism is that if we grow too depenant on technology, we will destroy our natural environment and there will be very dire consequences.
We want NEW material to be produced, using new technology, that is consistent with, and builds upon the original formula.
Again, if Classic Sonic is truely playable, that IS a giant step foward. It really is!
Did you know**, if you play any of the 4 classics (3 if you count Sonic* 3 and Knuckles as one game),then go play Super Mario World, Sonic doesn’t run ANY faster than Mario, when you hold the B button to run?
“Even if the gameplay sucks, this is such a huge step forward, it’s unreal…”
Whoa… let’s not go there.
Go where? Classic Sonic DOES make the game that much more immersive, so it IS a giant step foward.
“Did you know**, if you play any of the 4 classics (3 if you count Sonic* 3 and Knuckles as one game),then go play Super Mario World, Sonic doesn’t run ANY faster than Mario, when you hold the B button to run?”
@Anon Touche! Anyways, I keep trying to explain to everyone at Gamefaqs etc. that Sonic was never about speed, and the original was never chocked full of loop-de-loops. Hell, even 2, my favorite game in the series, while having more slopes, did NOT have loops in every stage.
As for Sonic not running faster than Mario on flat ground, I’m sorry to say that a game like that would be poo-pooed by today. People bash Sonic 06, horrible as it is, for Sonic not running fast without boost pads, and yet that’s exactly how it was in Sonic 1, 2, 3K and CD! He would either need a sideway spring, a boost pad of some sort, or of course, a slope to be able to run REALLY fast. If Sega releases a Sonic game in wich Sonic doesn’t run faster than Mario today, it would be critically panned.
@ hsvelocity
Oh, awesome! Another Sonicfan who knows what he’s talking about!
And yeah, I agree with your post.
But about Sonic’s speed. He doesn’t have to be as slow as Mario, he goes definately faster than him when he is in ball form while rolling down a hill.
@Anon
“Fact to support that opinion: It’s a stupid name that makes you not wanna take that villain seriously. What if Kim Jong Il suddednly wanted us to call him Squatty FlatHead. Would you take him seriously?”
Oh, come on. Eggman was never like a really serious villain, if you look at the original version by Sonic Team. All this bullshit about “the eeeevil Robuttnik, who torments defenseless animals and eats kittens for breakfast” was promoted by PR department of the American Sega, and is not an original in the first place. Just look at the Japanese concept arts from the retro trilogy to understand that Japanese Eggman from the very beginning was designed as fun and cheerful, and not some horrible villain. Therefore, the name Eggman, his original name given by his creators, fits him well.
Yeah. How about YOU make a game, then? Let’s see how zero years under the belt will serve you versus Sega’s 35+ years making games. Then everyone can complain and pick apart everything you do. dissapointment is expected, but it seems people fail to realize anything GOOD in recent Sega games as long as there is something to complain about. Honestly. Trolls in the real world. Who’d have thought?