A Nearly 3:1 Margin Still Want to See Franchise Continue
Despite Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode I taking a shellacking among much of the community, with Sonic Generations to this point having the opposite effect, a majority of participants in the latest TSSZ News @Issue poll still say should that continue, so should the livelihood of the Sonic 4 franchise.
We asked if future Sonic 4 episodes should be cancelled if Generations finds success. Out of 1,079 votes, 74 percent voted No–indicating that a healthy audience remains for the download-only series. Still over a quarter of respondents, 26 percent, voted Yes.
A new poll is available to vote on, and the results of the latest poll can be discussed below.
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I’d like to see it continue but only if they fix the godawful physics.
Sega, you managed to make Sonic 4 less fun than Sonic 1.
That was difficult question but I voted yes. Why?
Because in my opinion S4 was made for retro fans. I really enjoyed playing it but if Dimps is going to just make separate DLC for Sonic Generetions then I think they should take care of 3DS games, leaving big consoles for generetions team and NGP for colors team. This is my opinion.
Sonic 4 is Sonic 4, NOT Sonic Generations. One’s success should not deny another’s. Also, they owe it to those of us who paid 15 bucks to finish this little escapade.
@ Skai Cyan
I guess it was all to do with SG making Sonic 4 somewhat redundant, since it seems to do classic gameplay better, in terms of physics and platforming. I wonder why ST even decided to make S4 with Generations already in development. Having said that, i agree ST should finish mainly because, well, they already started it, and I’d like to see it become the sequel to S3&K that it should be.
There wouldn’t be any reason to cancel it, just improve the physics for Episode II.
Personally I enjoyed Episode 1, I was excited by the cliffhanger and I hope to see the series conclude. I’m hoping that Episode 2 could fill the gap between now and Generations, otherwise Sonic’s anniversary year is largely going to be lacking Sonic.
lol Discontinue Sonic 4, who’s silly idea was THAT? XDDD
I think what the article means to say is “Tho Sonic the Hedgehog 4: Episode I has taken a shellacking among a small group of the community, with Sonic Generations to this point having the opposite effect, a majority of participants in the latest TSSZ News @Issue poll say should that continue, so should the livelihood of the Sonic 4 franchise.
We asked if future Sonic 4 episodes should be cancelled if Generations finds success. Out of 1,079 votes, 74 percent voted No–indicating that a healthy audience remains for the download-only series. Still over a quarter of respondents, 26 percent, voted Yes.
A new poll is available to vote on, and the results of the latest poll can be discussed below.”
=P
Anyhoo, if anything, I believe Sonic Generations should PROMOTE the continuation of Sonic 4 as they can show improvement, progress, also because there’s a difference between doing a SEQUEL to a classic saga and a REMAKE of a classic saga. I believe Sonic Generations is obligated to not just make classic-styled gameplay, but specifically mimmick it as it is the same era of Sonic history while Sonic 4 is actually a completely new game (even IF it takes place before currently existing games, it is still it’s own seperate fragment of the storyline)
Besides, the physics weren’t that bad. All they need to do is tweak the kinetic energy of Sonic and there you go. He accelerates negative when in mid air (instead of insta-stop), he rolls faster going down hill, slowing going up hill, and the stuff so on and such. Those were minor issues that only bother you if you’re a nitpick. Nothing wrong with that, but just saying, it IS a small enough issue that it can avoid bothering 3/4 of the fanbase. It’s DEFINATELY more like the classics than Sonic Unleashed is or Sonic Heroes. If no one can see that, then perhaps they’d like to meet the dozens of parents who saw their children playing Sonic 4 and said “Hey it looks like the old Sonic I used to play when you were little” XD
Generations is different from Sonic 4 in a certain perspective. Generations has the two best styles of gameplay in sonic history. But sonic 4 should be a blend of that. If they said that they were trying to do something new with it, then why shun that? I do agree that the physics need to have a major overhaul, but in return i think they need to add new-age mechanics and/or more moves, like the stomp, or maybe a shadow the hedgehog-styled boost (where only if the bar is full, then you do the boost). Stop marketing to the assholes who dont even appreciate SEGA’s efforts, ditch them and listen to the people who actually care.
Sega
Give us a FREE physics update for episode 1.
And make episode 2 the REAL sonic 4, aka, continue S3&K saga.
“Stop marketing to the assholes who dont even appreciate SEGA’s efforts, ditch them and listen to the people who actually care.”
Or they can continuously make great games that don’t suck. That’ll shut the “assholes” up: Actually putting effort.
“Stop marketing to [normal people who like to trade their hard-earned money for good products], ditch them and listen to the people who [will actually buy any shit game with Sonic on it, even if it sucks dicks].”
Fixed for ya, darkgomugomu.
“Stop marketing to the assholes who dont even appreciate SEGA’s efforts, ditch them and listen to the people who actually care.”
Look how Sonic Generations work PERFECT:
NO uncurling, good physic, good animations, good sound and graphics.
Fans put all erros in sonic 4 and we give a finally awesome sonic .
We have force to change the final product.
I think that Sonic 4 episode 2 should have the same physics as Sonic 3&K, except you can use homing attack as well. In every classic game, Sonic gains a new move with a new game…. (Sonic 2: Spin Dash, Sonic CD: Super Peel Out, Sonic 3&K: Insta-Shield, Sonic 4: Homing Attack)
im not even gonna bother replying to anything
You know, I was really dissappointed with Sonic 4. I only played it when it was discounted, and I haven´t replayed the game once since then. But you know, I don´t care if Episode 1 was bad. Make Episode 2 better, there´s no excuse for discontinue the game now. Fix it and call it a deal.
The problem wasn´t the idea, it was the execution.
Physics didn’t matter until Sonic 4 became public, then all of a sudden Sonic’s gameplay revolved around the physics, when for 19 years it wasn’t even brought up. Strange isn’t it?
In regards to the new poll, why would E3 not hold relevance?
@RaggtimeSonic
UGH.
It didn’t matter because the game played great. It suddenly started to matter once it started to SUCK ASS.
It’s not AT ALL strange. Somehow people are not complaining about Sonic Generations’ physics. Yes, because it seems to be right this time.
Really, pick a better argument, for heaven’s sakes.
In my opinion, the results of this poll turned out the way they did because of the way it was worded.
Rather than asking if fans would prefer to see Sonic 4 continued in the style of classic Generations, it merely asked if we would want Sonic 4 canceled, without actually inferring that a Generations-esque series would continue on in its place.
When you pose a question that way, it’s fairly obvious how the results will play out.
@ChaoticFox
Yes, quite true. Though I still voted to cancel this shit. They should cancel it, and just try it again, but for real this time. Also, Iizuka should be undressed and slapped hard on his ass by a giant Classic Sonic, and the video posted on YouTube with the title “TRY AGAIN”, a la Robotnik in Sonic 1′s bad ending.
@krazeeKidd102
That’s basically what he just got through saying. Continue making great Sonic games aimed at those who can actually see and appreciate the effort SEGA puts rather than catering to ppl who don’t like their games anyways. The games don’t suck to ppl who actually LIKE SONIC GAMES. XD
@Andre
Whoa WTF!? I thought you said you WEREN’T a retro nazi! You basically just said “I think it’s shit so if you like it then you like shit because my opinion is right and yours is wrong!” which is bias to all hell! XDD And yeah, those who complain over an unimportant design change being a fan of a series they haven’t liked for more than a decade since they were younger rather than just moving on to something ELSE that might entertain them because they’re busy arguing politics over a childish video game because they believe there’s “honor” attached to it are the NORMAL PEOPLE. lol
@Andre (Again)
It is kinda strange that, according to the fanbase, it started to “suck ass” about 8 or so years ago but the physics thing only came up recently. Sort’ve like how ppl just got through loving Sonic’s Brawl model and then Unleashed model, now they had Modern Sonic’s design entirely. lol (Also, I don’t see why you said “pick a better argument” when he was JUST COMMENTING. As in just making a remark or pointing out.)
@ChaoticFox
Uhh… I think the way it was worded is probably the better way since the alternative way you mentioned is a completely different question. lol The question was if it was pointless to continue Sonic 4 if Sonic Generations proved superior. Considering there’s a lot of ppl bashing Sonic 4 pretending like they’re the majority, the “obvious results” would be that more ppl would want it to be cancelled if Sonic Generations is a success. To be honest, those “physics problems” ppl are complaining about, I don’t even know how to identify them because I either rarely use them or never NOTICE them while playing anyways. When I was young I wasn’t exited about “momentum”. I was excited about running through loops and jumping on enemies. XD
@Andre:
“Also, Iizuka should be undressed and slapped hard on his ass by a giant Classic Sonic, and the video posted on YouTube with the title “TRY AGAIN”, a la Robotnik in Sonic 1′s bad ending.”
Uh… no?
@Foxboy
Retro nazi or modern game enthusiast, If you’re a fan of quality video games, Sonic 4 is empirically bad. Case closed
Regarding your response to my comment: uh… if Generations proved superior but Sega had no plans of making future games in the same style, then cancelling Sonic 4 completely would be pointless (not to mention a poor business decision), as would the poll question.
TGenerations is completely irrelevant to Sonic 4, apart from the fact that literally everyone agrees that it’s infinitely better looking. Why would you cancel Sonic 4 just because Generations was successful? The only reason to do that would be because of the obvious disparity in quality. Thus, the poll should have read “Should Sonic Team give up on Sonic 4, as it is now, and create a game more like the classic side of Generations INSTEAD?”
If that were the case, the votes would have likely turned out quite a bit differently. But when you ask a group of fanboys “do you want them to stop making Sonic games?” and tack on a completely irrelevant qualifier, the results are going to be obvious.
@Komodin
Actually yes, but thanks for playing.
My problem with STH4: Ep1 is that they used Dimps. Dimps has already proved that they cannot make a game with decent physics, so why use Dimps. If I were SEGA\Sonic Team, I wouldn’t let Dimps anywhere near Sonic 4. And I don’t have a problem with the Green Eyes. Over at retro (I said Sonic Retro! Oh no!!! Dun dun DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUHN!), there’s a photo of Modern Sonic with black eyes and Classic Sonic with green eyes, and Pot-bellied Sonic with green eyes looks kinda spiffy!
(I’m sorry if I offended anybody with that last parenthesized words. It was a joke, and I should be more careful with my jokes.
)
@ChaoticFox
You’re opinion is that it’s bad. Many people’s opinions are that it’s good. You’re basically saying that their opinion is wrong simply because YOU don’t agree with it. What is it about the difference between fact and opinion do you people not understand!?
And exactly! It WOULD be pointless and a bad decision. That’s why I voted that they shouldn’t discontinue it. But there were people who DID say they should, that’s probably why the poll was made. But still your alternative isn’t a good one because you keep involving the idea of another game or a Sonic 4 that is LIKE Sonic Generations somehow, and the whole point of the poll is the difference between Sonic 4 itself and Sonic Generations itself. Whether or not they should make a more Generations-styled Classic-esque Sonic game is a completely different question that is pretty much already answered since before we even heard of Generations.
@Andre
No. He probably said “no” because what you said was completely ridiculous. Why would they humiliate a man publically like that? It’s not worth it. It sounds like the idea of a psycho fan nerd (Especially with the Sonic 1 Robotnik reference added to it.) It’s like when you suggest stuff like that all we can do is stare at you blankly for about 7 seconds taking in the large amount of random psychotic imagination you had before just walking away and pretending we didn’t hear something that outrageous. XD
@Sonic Player
o.o Dimps is also helping work on Generations for 3DS. .-. lol
Who knows, Generations could turn out to be even worse than 4.
Foxboy, if the question were merely about whether Sonic 4 should be canceled or not, it would not have even made mention of Generations. Without the implied inference that Generations should replace Sonic 4′s style going forward, it becomes a completely irrelevant point tacked onto the poll for no reason. It may as well have said “If Michael Jordan ran for president, should they cancel Sonic 4?”, and if it had, we would have gotten the same results. However, what I am saying is that if the poll were worded how I believe it were (or should have been) intended, we would have gotten different results. As it stands now, the poll results are mostly only telling us that people want to see Sonic 4 continued, without any specific direction as to HOW. What it doesn’t address is the much more relevant issue of whether Generations success will render Sonic 4′s current STYLE obsolete.
Quality can be gauged and measured. Value… not so much. People can enjoy something, and they’re welcome to that opinion, but that alone does not make it good, or change the subject in question’s quantifiable level of quality. You may like your shitty beat up couch with holes in it because it is comfortable, but it is still a piece of shit couch when compared to something with a higher level of polish and quality. You’re welcome to have fun with Sonic 4, and you’re welcome to like it… but if you wanna get down to the nitty gritty factual science of good design, Sonic 4 doesn’t quite cut the mustard, end of story.
You can argue that all you like, but I’m not a pacifistic little girl scout who thinks that gravity is a matter of opinion. Some things are factual, whether people disagree with them or not. I believe there are standards and principles of good design that exist independantly from my personal opinion. There is some music I can listen to and acknowledge as “good” even if I personally dislike it and would never listen to it. Conversely, there is some music that I know is awful that I enjoy anyway. The same applies to everything else.
the new poll is i kinda dumb question x.x
and if the cancel sonic 4, that’ll be 2 sonic storylines that won’t see a conclusion…. oh sonic chronicles…..
“is a kinda dumb question”
sorry for the typo ^.^’
@FoxBoy
Perhaps it was a fucking joke.
(EDIT – Inflammatory -T)
Sonic 4 had potential, I would love to see more episodes to come.
Just fix the physics and create original stages, Sega.
Sure I liked some of the stages in episode 1 but because they are similar to what already had existed.
Wouldn’t it be awesome if Sonic Generations secretly ended Sonic 4 while on it’s history spanning journey? After all, 4 is supposed to be after 3&Knuckles. So when Sonic gets to that point in Generations, we see the last half of 4 in the process! An awesome, cross media, meta idea!
I for one thought 4 was merely to test the waters anyway. After all the hate it got, they were quick to fix the problems for Generations. So in a way 4 existed to test the idea they had for Generations.
@ Andre.
Hey man, is there any other way besides here I can contact you with?
@RC1020
Sure, why?
andrebm55@hotmail.com
@Jim-x
“Who knows, Generations could turn out to be even worse than 4.”
No way in hell is Generations going to be worse than Sonic 4. Some peeps were criticizing the shit out of S4 as soon as the first “trailer” was revealed. Some of them didn’t even end up playing it. And you know what? Much of their criticism still held merit and they could say “I told you so” in the end. I have a lot of hope for Generations. Sega clearly learned from their mistakes and isn’t pulling S4-esque marketing this time around, and combined with the success of Colors, I believe we’re gonna have ourselves a winner.
@ Andre.
Haha, I just think your posts are intelligent and witty and I agree with just about all of them, so I figured maybe we can have our own conversations without drawing too much attention on a public site like this, you know?
If that’s ok with you of course.
@ChaoticFox
I don’t see why this is hard to understand. The question wasn’t about just if Sonic 4 should be cancelled or not, it was about whether or not it should be cancelled if Sonic Generations ends up being successful due to doing a better job of being like the classics. Sonic 4 changing it’s own style to be moe like Generations is a completely different topic.
And seriously, that Michael Jordon example would’ve gotten the same results? Cuz I’d see MORE ppl saying should continue then since MJ has nothing to do with Sonic while Generations has Classic styled Sonic gameplay in it.
“What it doesn’t address is the much more relevant issue of whether Generations success will render Sonic 4′s current STYLE obsolete.” That’s EXACTLY what the question is asking. Would Sonic 4 be obsolete if Generations is a success? HOW it continues in terms of if Sonic 4′s style would change or not is a completely irrelevant topic as it’s a different question: “Should Sonic 4 continue it’s current style or try to be more like Generations’ style?”
You know, out of all the times you speak of stuff on that particular subject you always seem to basically say that, even entertainment wise, that it’s not good entertainment just because it successfully entertains. That’s exactly what makes it good entertainment tho! So the rest of this right here is a load of crap for words. -.-
That couch example is also bad because the only way for a beat up couch to be shitty is if you see it that way, that’s an OPINION. If someone likes it, then to them it is GOOD! The reason it’s considered bad is cuz the majority see it that way and thus it’s easier to label it that way. But in this case the majority liked Sonic 4 while you don’t. So a better example would be if it were a nice polished couch, comfy and all, but it was too soft for you. Then you think it was a worthless pile of crap. You’d be telling us “You can enjoy your worthless pile of crap if you want but it’s still crap” just cuz YOU disliked it even tho we say it’s a great couch. The point is, it’s a perspective, an opinion and you continue to push that YOUR opinion is right above all others even when you’re outnumbered. Well get over it. Sonic 4 got the highest review score Sonic’s gotten in about a decade and by a reviewing organization that previously bashed Sonic in bias manners. They also gave a similar score to Sonic Colors. I’m guessing that’s a pile of crap too huh? lol But wait, it can’t be cuzi t’s an OPINIOB. XP
Seriously, why do ppl have a hard time telling the difference between fact and opinion? XP
^ teh foxes are going at it!
@FoxBoy
I hope you don’t mind me interjecting here on y’alls conversation
“That couch example is also bad because the only way for a beat up couch to be shitty is if you see it that way, that’s an OPINION. If someone likes it, then to them it is GOOD! The reason it’s considered bad is cuz the majority see it that way and thus it’s easier to label it that way. But in this case the majority liked Sonic 4 while you don’t.”
I personally think the couch analogy explained things quite well. ChaoticFox was right; quality can be measured, personal value can’t. You say that the only reason for a beat up couch to be shitty is if you see it that way, and that opinion can make something good. I’m saying you can polish a turd (see Mythbusters), but in the end it’s still a turd. There has to be a measure of quality in this world. That is how we have standards. It is a part of the natural law. If everyone grooved to your opinion, which is that quality is set solely by opinion, then imagine a world where you couldn’t give feedback on anything.
President: “Our economy is bad because you think it’s bad.”
Not only that, but nobody could be good at (insert talent here) anymore. Comparisons wouldn’t exist because there would be no basis on how to judge. So, I’m going to have to politely disagree with you on that point
ChaoticFox”There is some music I can listen to and acknowledge as “good” even if I personally dislike it and would never listen to it. Conversely, there is some music that I know is awful that I enjoy anyway. The same applies to everything else.”
That’s because there’s 2 different opinions being applied. -.-
Opinion 1: Whether or not it’s good.
Opinion 2: Whether or not you like it.
Both ARE opinions as, in a fact, music is not good nor bad, it is just sound. It can be used for good or bad reasons or be a good or bad time for music, or a good or bad choice for certain ppl to listen to (due to their opinion on whether or not they like it), but it’s the same with singers too. If someone is said to have a talent and well-liked because everyone says he’s a good singer, that doesn’t mean everyone will have the same opinion. Some might think it’s bad.
@Andre
Chill. xD
@Zephyr
Ohhh yeeaaah that’s right! XD
Saying “you can polish a turd but in the end it’s still a turd” doesn’t mean anything cuz that’s like saying “you can dusk a trophy but in the end it’s still a trophy”. That’s referring what the subject IS, not one’s perspective of it as good or bad. In other words, you using “turd” as the example is nothing more than a random subject you decided to use and has no connection to the Sonic 4 thing. A different example would have to be used in order for “turd” to specifically be relevant. lol
Even then, “Turd” helps us grow food. To farmers, it is something they want to have and use for their crops. It is also nature. So to them it is good. To us, we have no use for it and it makes everything stink. To us, it’s bad. So in the end it is still perspective opinion.
You: “There has to be a measure of quality in this world. That is how we have standards. It is a part of the natural law.”
Me: “in this case the majority liked Sonic 4″
That is how you measure it. lol
“imagine a world where you couldn’t give feedback on anything.”
That… would be a bad thing. This part sort’ve sounds like you’re agreeing with me tho since I’m the one saying that entertainment’s quality is decided on how many ppl found it entertaining and how much they found it entertaining, which is opinion. xD That and in this situation I’m saying to NOT state your opinion as fact above other ppl (because doing so is like telling other ppl their opinion is wrong the wrong choice just cuz it’s different. I have no problem with someone viewing the game as crap, just with them stating it as a fact saying anyone who liked it must like crap then when that is ONLY true to people who share that opinion. XD)
Economy is not entertainment. Economy is a necessity for our way of survival. You people should really think about the examples you’re using. XP for anyone to really listen t othem would mean they were tricked and manipulated (even if you’re not trying to trick or manipulate them lol).
“nobody could be good at (insert talent here) anymore. Comparisons wouldn’t exist because there would be no basis on how to judge.”
Tell that to American Idol, X-Factor, Voice and America’s Got Talent! All successful shows still running too. XD
btw, what I meant by that last part is that you’re basically agreeing with me again! Shows like I listed have judges where people give their opinions and VOTE! The MAJORITY of opinions is the best to go with as it pleases the most. Like I’ve said before, someone can have a major audience cheering for them and all 3 judges might think it’s good but someone at home watching it on tv can say they sung terrible or it wasn’t that impressive. Or in Justin Beiber’s case, that he sucks. XD BUT, they’re just opinions, so there is no right and wrong in the end when it coems to reality. The “right” is substituted by “the majority’s opinion” which we call “good” because it’s good to the majority, not to everyone in the world, while a fact remains a fact nomatter what you think of it.
If Justin Beiber was ACTUALLY a bad singer just cuz he is to a lot of us, he wouldn’t be successful as much as he is, which he only is because MORE people shared the opinion that he didn’t suck. The majority’s opinion thinks he’s good, so as far as entertainment goes he’s considered “good”, hence his success. Neither him being a good singer or a bad singer is a fact (you know, unless he, as a fact, was unable to control his vocal chords). =P (And I don’t even like Justin Beiber and I’m saying this. xD It’s just logical. 0.0)
There are some people logic can’t sway. For everyone else, there’s ChaoticFox
@ChaoticFox
“There are some people logic can’t sway.”
And this my friends, is the natural law of the unnatural Sonic fandom.
@FoxBoy
You know, I’d like to comment back on a few of your points, but it’s getting late and I still have many non-hedgehog related things to do. I’ll give you an essay tomorrow
@FoxBoy Point taken, and Dimps will get a medal of EPIC IMPROVEMENT if Generations proves successful. I think it’s looking good.
EDIT: 3DS version… harrumph. ‘Tis not surprising to me. But they better get it right… or they’ll get slapped… SONIC #134 STYLE!!!!
Just say it, Zephyr!
This is a ridiculous poll. Sega would not be so irresponsible to cancel Sonic 4(2) or Sonic 4.5. Fact is, I found episode one to be mediocre at best. I haven’t replayed it, and I haven’t even bothered getting all the chaos emeralds when I can just YouTube the ending. The good news is that Sonic 4 episode 2 is probably going to be better as long as they throw in some new levels and ideas. And for heavens sake, SONIC DOES NOT ACCELERATE THAT SLOWLY!!!!
I personally would not mind seing another game with characters other than Sonic. However, best bets are to stick to Tails, Knuckles, and Shadow. And if you bring Knuckles back, give him a similar fighting style to the werehog. I still think that SA2 is still the best Sonic game past genesis.